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There and Back Again: A Look at Japanese VRPGs VS American CRPGs
RPGs are one of the most beloved genres of games for hard-core console or PC gamers, yet each platform provides very different gaming
experiences. Many readers of this site might have lost their RPG cherry with a Computer Role-Playing Game (CRPG) such as Ultima or Wizardry. My experience started out with Video Game RPGs (VRPGs). This is a brief look at differences between the two mixed with nostalgic memories of playing a variety of RPGs growing up.
The very first VRPG I ever played was the original Dragon Warrior for the NES, when I was 7 years old. In the game your avatar was Edgar,
a knight for the King that had a whopping two quests to complete: save the Princess and slay the DragonLord. You could buy new weapons, learn new spells, navigate through dungeons, and fight adorable monsters, all to the strains of Koichi Sugiyama's classical music
with a chiptune twinge.
Despite being the first VRPGs that set the mold for most Japanese VRPGs to follow, not much has changed in gameplay style since Dragon Warrior (known as Dragon Quest in Japan). The gameplay boils down to a fairly simple flowchart of Town-->Quest-->Dungeon-->Town. The avatar recieves a main quest from a town and is told to complete it by going to a dungeon. After completing the quest, usually by retrieving a special treasure or defeating a nefarious boss monster, the avatar returns to the town to gain a reward and a clue as to what village to go to complete the next quest.
Inbetween each step of the flowchart is a boatload of cut-scenes, which are customary in Japanese VRPGs. They help propel the plot and flesh out party members and NPCs in the game. Instead of generating characters from scratch, you are given party members with predetermined roles and a bit of quirk. This leads to endearing characters and help turn more modern VRPGs into an interactive anime-- the reward for completing a quest in a VRPG is a cartoon cutscene. Later on I played several VRPGs on the SNES such as Lufia: Rise of the Sinistrals, Earthbound, and Final Fantasy III (Final Fantasy VI in Japan) enjoyed their similar style of gameplay and increasingly complicated plots (though Lufia has a party member who was obsessed with cinammon pie?!).
Much later, I was in middle school and got more into PC gaming. I was a big fan of retro-compilations even then and was sampling some
titles from Interplay's 10th Anniversary Collection. One of these was an early CRPG, The Bard's Tale. The title screen had a charming image
of a Bard sitting at a bar spinning stories of derring-do like no other. 20 minutes later, I generated a small party, equipped their
default weapons, and set out to explore the village of Skara Brae. A few steps later, my party encountered a small group of Orcs. I barely
made it past the first battle and hobbled back to the Bar for rest. This was clearly a different kind of creature than Dragon Warrior.
I was familiar from party generation from what few tabletop RPGs sessions I played with friends. The sheer difficulty is what was such a turn-off initially, as was the first-person perspective. Later on, I grew to enjoy mapping out dungeons on a sheet a graph paper because it added to the sense of discovery, but it was a huge difference from the Japanese VRPGs I grew up on. The lack of narrative was a bit dissapointing, but that the game was almost pure combat made it feel much more primal and raw to its tabletop roots.
VRPGs were like being given a tour of a village with a guide holding your hand, pointing out interesting spots along the way. CRPGs were like being thrown into a dark cave with nobody holding your hand, like a lamb preparing to be slaughtered.
Anyone else have any memories or preferences of the classic CRPG VS VRPG debate? I decided to keep things simple to prevent this article from reaching epic length. :) I feel a good blend of American and Japanese RPGs was found in Baldur's Gate 2 or Fallout for the PC-- you had some sort of a plot, but had enough freedom where you weren't locked in such a linear game progression.
- Mat Tschirgi's blog
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Comments
German CRPGs
Well, I was thinking of the Ambermoon/Amberstar games, as well as Darklands and Gothic. Those are the ones right off the top of my head. I'm sure there must have been many more that never made it into English versions.
german crpg's? fill me in. Im sure I know some but I dont automatically go 'german crpgs!'
-- Stu --
Ze Germans are coming!
german crpg's? fill me in. Im sure I know some but I dont automatically go 'german crpgs!'
-- Stu --
American Exports
As far as I can tell, many games were exported, and were huge hits in Japan. The ultima series in particular comes to mind, but Wizardry, Phantasie, and other series certainly made it over. Indeed, much with American rockstars, these games seem to live a new life over there, and some new games were made that were released only in Japan (I'm thinking here of Phantasie IV, but there are many others). I'd be very curious to know if these games were considered better over there than the Japanese-originals, or how they fit into that lineup. Surely not EVERY Japanese CRPG fan preferred the anime-style art and cuteness of games like Zelda and Final Fantasy. There must have been a group that preferred Ultima and Wizardry style.
I'm sure we could see the same thing in Germany, which could be rather interesting. I wonder how many German CRPGs migrated to Japan and vice versa?
WRPG/CRPG influence over in Japan
-- Stu --
Good question. Obviously Wizardry and Ultima were hugely influential over there, but once JRPG development got fully underway in the late 80's, they seemed to diverge onto their own paths. You almost wonder if they consider WRPG or CRPG games their own class of game as well...
======================================
Bill Loguidice, Managing Director
Armchair Arcade, Inc.
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the other view
were there any translations of say BG or PST to japanese? Id be curious to know how they see western crpgs'
-- Stu --
JRPGs don't let you choose your role
-- Stu --
I agree with you there. I don't like calling them RPGs at all, because you don't actually get to choose a role. You play the path you're given. The same applies with TLJ and Dreamfall.
The only customisation you really get to make is in the type of damage you do. I enjoy the Final Fantasy games from a storytelling and world-building perspective but I do have trouble immersing myself in the characters. They're more an interactive movie than actual role-playing.
Autopause in NWN?
I thought at least one of the BG and NWN games had an option to pause after each turn, or at least after every round. I know I set it to auto-pause after every death and I'm sure that was pretty close to the fully-automated end of the spectrum.
I quite liked the faux-real-time aspect of those games. I felt that it really made you pay attention to the battles, whereas pure turn-based fights can get a bit... casual. The atmosphere just feels a little too relaxed for me.
--
The Average Gamer
Old is New
I've often had this thought as well. Take the basic gameplay of a game like Pool of Radiance (or Phantasie), vamp up the graphics, sound, interface, etc., but keep the gameplay intact. We're starting to see this (to a limited extent) with the old adventure classics, though it's always a grassroots/hobbyist effort and never (at least to my mind) a commercial enterprise. I'm still holding out for XLA or something similar to get very serious about updating classics without marring the gameplay. It's critical not to much around with the basic mechanics, though this seems to be all too common ("Let's make this 2D classic 3D! Let's make this turn-based game real-time! Let's get rid of the challenge and spoonfeed the gamer!")
Paradigm shifts in gaming
I think the "perfect" mix would be to have a way to switch between modes, so that you could run the "busywork" encounters in real-time, but slow down to turn-based for the big battles. This was implemented to some degree in Baldur's Gate and NWN, where you could pause the game to give orders, but it still wasn't as "sit back and think" the way the Gold Box games were.
I think this is a disturbing trend in ALL genres on all platforms. The only major turn-based strategy game released of recent vintage that I can readily recall is Civilization IV and its various expansions (latest expansion just released), and even that is hinting at moving to more real-time stuff with the next iteration for consoles and handhelds. It's interesting, but it's almost like the shift we saw from text-based games to all graphics games in the mainstream, and from 2D to 3D. It seems like another shift can be seen from turn-based to real-time or modified real-time. It seems as technology continues to progress, there is more focus - or need if you will - on/to "flashier", more "motion-based" elements. Just like the other shifts, this almost complete shift away from any type of turn-based play is not true progress, not fully a good thing. And also as with the other shifts, some things just work better the "old" way.
I'd love just once, regardless of genre, for a major publisher to create one uber mainstream game in an old style, be it a 2D turn-based CRPG with an epic scope, a 2D platformer with an epic scope, a ultra-intelligent text-based game, etc. Go all out with the art, sound, writing, advertising, etc., as applicable, and really see what happens. Costs would at the very least approximate or in some cases come in lower than equivalent 3D epic games and the uniqueness would probably move product, at least the first time. And yes, I know that indie developers and publishers still do this, but frankly they'll never match the reach or the name recognition of an EA or Activision, as just two examples. It will also never happen, regardless, but I'd still like to see it.
======================================
Bill Loguidice, Managing Director
Armchair Arcade, Inc.
======================================
Japanense vs. US CRPGs
I might remind new readers to check out my older look at this subject, Kawaisa!, in which I naively tried to compare the two genres (Mat has done a much better job here, I think).
What interests me about the Japanese CRPGs is how much they borrowed from the early Ultima games, particularly 2-4. In fact, there's a fun story in which Garriott went to Japan to work out a deal for the licensing, and was approached by one of the lead Ultima-clone developers. The guy started showing Garriott their game, but it soon became obvious that it wasn't just a clone--it was a downright copy. Whole sections of the artwork had been ripped. The book that tells this story (Official Book of Ultima) doesn't identify exactly what game this was, but the name Xanadu pops up. Instead of getting the license, they agreed to an out of court settlement with Origin!
At any rate, it's certainly possible to detect a certain "cuteness" in some of Origin's Ultima and some of there other CRPGs, such as Chuckles' 2400 A.D. But I think the key difference between Japanese and American CRPGs are the target age groups. The Japanese seem to target the 7-12 year old group, whereas American games seem to assume you're at least 15 or 16 (i.e., old enough to play the tabletop D&D game, read Tolkien, etc.). If you're dealing with a 7 year old, you know you have to keep it simple and fast-paced. What always stuns me is how much inane dialog you're expecting to sit through in these games. For the most part, it's mostly stuff culled from what seem to be fairy tales. As we might expect, the main character is usually an adolescent boy...A bit younger than I usually want to play!
What's funny is that some of the later Japanese games try to seem more adult by adding in cuss words and sexual material. Try as I might, I can't get past the style of the graphics and see anything but a kid's game with some "mature stuff" grafted on.
I'll confess, though, the only VRPGs I've played through are the first Final Fantasy (NES) and Chrono Trigger (SNES). Of the two, Chrono Trigger was definitely the best, with a polished storyline, good ambiance, and excellent overall timing. Although it's a Disney-esque kid's game, it is highly entertaining for all ages. The first Final Fantasy was extremely repetitive with wave after wave of pretty much meaningless random encounters. It was torture. I still need to go back and play the Dragon Warrior games and Zelda, as well as Phantasy Star.
I think a more disturbing trend in all CRPGs is away from strategy and tactics and more towards "action" games." This began in earnest with Diablo and has carried on since, and now it's impossible to find a new CRPG that indulges in turn-based combat. In fact, the last ones I can remember making the attempt were Pool of Radiance: Ruins of Myth Drannor (HORRID), and Temple of Elemental Evil (decent).
I think the "perfect" mix would be to have a way to switch between modes, so that you could run the "busywork" encounters in real-time, but slow down to turn-based for the big battles. This was implemented to some degree in Baldur's Gate and NWN, where you could pause the game to give orders, but it still wasn't as "sit back and think" the way the Gold Box games were.